Breeding Clams at home

My main concern isnt getting the maximum amount to live but the general process it self at first. So out of those 10000 eggs that get fertilized, I'm only planing on maybe 10 surviving past a month.

I wont be just throwing them into my DT water line, dead eggs and dead sperm, that would be stupid.

Whether or not i have a microscope doesnt mean there is nothing to be learned from the process. Theres a ton more information that can be learned from it.

The sperm only lives for at most 15min. from what i read, the eggs float. So after 15 min, i could easily cycle out the vast majority of the waste and introduce into my tanks cycle. Filtered by mesh screens ranging from 100-5microns will ensure that no harmful pests will get in and damage them. There are still a few other things i have to find out before hand, but this is finals week at WSU so it will have to wait till this weekend.

So there wont be a need for a lot of water changes, algae scrubbers do really really well at cleaning the water. Do you have one? or know someone that does? Mine is rated for a 400g tank so i'm hoping that should be ok. 300g may be small compared to the ocean, but the ocean is small compared to some planets. 300g is pretty massive, easy to keep water quality balances, tons of bacteria contained in the system, etc.

If the eggs are still really mixed in the water after the fertilization stage i'll use a filter to suck out the majority of the water to bring in fresh. to at least wash out any dead sperm. Then later that day you are supposed to be able to tell what eggs are fertilized and after they hatch i'll see about getting rid of whats left of the eggs.

There are a lot of unknowns right now and no way to be prepared for them. I'll work on typing up a paper on equipment etc that i think that i will need. Because i'm having to explain myself a little bit here and a little there. it's all in my head, but i dont have time right now to type it out.
 
BluScrnOdeth said:
My main concern isnt getting the maximum amount to live but the general process it self at first. So out of those 10000 eggs that get fertilized, I'm only planing on maybe 10 surviving past a month.
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With corals and anemones at least, the highest period of die-off is the first three months - this seems to be the critical stage. You will want much more than 10 to survive past one month.


BluScrnOdeth said:
Whether or not i have a microscope doesnt mean there is nothing to be learned from the process. Theres a ton more information that can be learned from it.
Click to expand...

I was talking about fertilization success and the methods used. Without a low-power dissecting scope, you'll have no idea what your starting numbers are and what worked/what didn't.


BluScrnOdeth said:
The sperm only lives for at most 15min. from what i read, the eggs float. So after 15 min, i could easily cycle out the vast majority of the waste and introduce into my tanks cycle. Filtered by mesh screens ranging from 100-5microns will ensure that no harmful pests will get in and damage them.
Click to expand...

Where did you read that the sperm only live for 15 minutes? Can you post a link?

I only ask b/c that is contrary to both the corals and anemones that I have worked with, and for a broadcast spawner taking chances in the ocean, trying to find an egg, that seems a prohibitively short life span for a sperm.


BluScrnOdeth said:
I wont be just throwing them into my DT water line, dead eggs and dead sperm, that would be stupid.
Click to expand...

How will you know which eggs will and will not be fertilized if the sperm only last for 15 minutes? Which to separate out and which to throw away?



BluScrnOdeth said:
So there wont be a need for a lot of water changes, algae scrubbers do really really well at cleaning the water. Do you have one? or know someone that does? Mine is rated for a 400g tank so i'm hoping that should be ok. 300g may be small compared to the ocean, but the ocean is small compared to some planets. 300g is pretty massive, easy to keep water quality balances, tons of bacteria contained in the system, etc.
Click to expand...

A few years ago, I was working with a closed system of about 300 gallons. There was very low fertilization of the coral larvae, and despite numerous 50% water changes over several days, the water would not clear up. I still maintain that if you have several hundred thousand eggs breaking apart, you will affect your whole system.

Now, if you rear the developing larvae for a few days separate from your main system (get them past day two, at least), then add those healthy larvae to your main system, as you described, I would feel better about that.


BluScrnOdeth said:
If the eggs are still really mixed in the water after the fertilization stage i'll use a filter to suck out the majority of the water to bring in fresh. to at least wash out any dead sperm. Then later that day you are supposed to be able to tell what eggs are fertilized and after they hatch i'll see about getting rid of whats left of the eggs.
Click to expand...

The ONLY WAY you will be able to tell which eggs are fertilized and which are not on the same day of fertilization is by placing them under a low-power dissecting scope. These things are going to be the size of a pin head to the naked eye. You can only see the cell division happening (they don't 'hatch') through the occular of a scope. MAYBE if you had an extreme macro lens for a DSLR, but I'm not even sure about that.

As I said earlier, unfertilized eggs will typically disintegrate in 24 hours, and unfit larvae seem to die off around day two or so.


BluScrnOdeth said:
There are a lot of unknowns right now and no way to be prepared for them. I'll work on typing up a paper on equipment etc that i think that i will need. Because i'm having to explain myself a little bit here and a little there. it's all in my head, but i dont have time right now to type it out.
Click to expand...

Well, people have done this before, so there should not be that many unknowns, if you are properly prepared.

Just trying to offer my experience as help, that's all.

Cheers
Mike
 
any input is appreciated. Thanks Mike.

The only info i have read about was on clam farms and such. one i decided to go with was an older document I think it was called the Clam Guide. I think in there it said the sperm lasts 15min. I'll have to double check.

http://www.ctsa.org/upload/publication/CTSA_130631672860873095404.pdf

page 33. its the eggs that last 15min, sperm is 1hr, i had it backwards. But either way then, after 15min, if the eggs arent fertilized, the eggs are dead and the excess sperm can be washed away.

Also in the document it states that the eggs are approximately 100um in size. After 12hrs they have grown to roughly 160um. With that said, it would be safe to say that i could line the bottom of the tank with an 80um screen after 15min to gather all the eggs. place them in a breeding tank for the next 12hrs. The breeding tank will be lined with a 100um screen and lifted to collect all those that actually did hatch and leaving behind the unhatched/unfertilized eggs. Then placed into another tank to continue the process at which time could be connected to my DT's plumbing.

The water from the DT will be pushed through a 5-10um filter (havent decided yet, maybe i'll use both) to keep predators out. The drain into my refuge will be covered with 100um filter to prevent them from getting sucked into the refuge.

One thing i'm hoping for, since i only do water changes every 4-6mo (since my water quality stays constant and i add some chemicals (alk and calc)) that there will be a good source of zoox present in my water with the clams i currently do have.

The inside of the clam (which i will need a microscope for so i will be getting one, i forgot about that part earlier) is supposed to turn a brown/gold color. IF that does not happen by day 2-3, i will have to take more drastic measures. Which i think there are only a few:

After removing from the DT plumbing
1. Cut a portion off a clam, extract the zoox and hope the donor clam heals and survives
2. Blend up a clam to extract the zoox
3. See if i can somehow scrape some off a clam in hopes that it regrows its zoox without it dyeing.

If there isnt enough zoox in the water column, i will be trying option 3 first, then 1, then 2 as a last resort.
 
Well, that's a compound light microscope. If you put larvae on that with a slide, it will just look like a big, dark blob, since light won't pass through the larvae. It's best to have a stereo-microscope (dissecting scope). And, a nice light source is really nice for zooming in for clear focus.

Good luck.

Cheers
Mike
 
oh, yeah, crap, didnt think about that with the light source for the compound. i'll look for a stereo-microscope, dissecting of course.
 
The drain into my refuge will be covered with 100um filter to prevent them from getting sucked into the refuge
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I have a feeling they will forced into the screen and damaged resulting in their death. I think your best bet would be to keep them in containers like mentioned in the paper written by simon ellis , atleast for the first 4-7 days then move them to your "nursery/settling" tank. I would suggest using only airlifts or something similar for movement and no other filtration until they all settle out. Then bring them online. Maybe try following the paper exactly but substitute "filtered" ocean water with synthetic. and the ocean with your 300 gal system.
 
They wont get crushed on the filter. It will act as a an overflow surface Skimmer. There will barely be any pressure there with a 100um filter being there.
 
crsaz said:
I think your best bet would be to keep them in containers like mentioned in the paper written by simon ellis , atleast for the first 4-7 days then move them to your "nursery/settling" tank. I would suggest using only airlifts or something similar for movement and no other filtration until they all settle out. Then bring them online. Maybe try following the paper exactly but substitute "filtered" ocean water with synthetic. and the ocean with your 300 gal system.
Click to expand...

This is almost exactly what we have done with coral and 'nem larvae - the gentle aeration I talked about earlier, combined with water changes. It may be low flow through the micron filter, but larvae tend to bind and clump to anything and everything, even each other (this is what I was saying earlier about each spawn season taking years off my life - they require almost constant, 24-hr care :) ).

So, while they may not be forced through filter enough to tear their membranes, they will certainly bind to it. Now, if you have GENTLE water flow across (parallel) to that filter, that might help your cause. This would be more of the kreisel design I spoke of earlier.

Cheers
Mike
 
Yeah, the design i'm thinking of will have the filter parallel to the surface of the water. Plus with it being up there, it will make it easy to take off the filter, put on a new one, and clean the old.

I do think that with the amount of eggs, after thinking about it for a couple days, that iw ill be using my spare 55g instead of the 10's. I think i might use the 10's to capture the sperm and eggs though, but until the first few days are over, i think that the 55g will be best.
 
ok, Finals are over as of Saturday. Time to get this going again. Algae Depot. kind of expensive, carries a live pure strain Iso G strain of algae. The Key, yet difficult to culter, strain of algae for this project. I'm ordering it today along with some other filters so i can "wash" the algae before putting the fertilized algae into the clean clam breeding tank.

I havent had time yet to type up a plan of how i'm going to do it but i hope to by next weekend. I have some work on my website to get done.

I will be ordering a microscope next weekend as well. That should give me some time to get the Iso G strain to grow more. Then I'll finish buying the other equipment (buckets, filters, etc) then i'll hunt down some clams.
 
I'll have to postpone this project for just a couple weeks. Ordered the supplies for my tank i'm building, should have it sometime next week. Been waiting on FAF to see if they can get any more ISO G in because i was wanting to order their measuring system and F/2 fertilizer all in one shot but they said it could be a little while till they will have any more.
 
Just another update.

On Friday i recieved my ISO G. According to FAF directions, it could take up to two weeks for this stuff to start populating. Hopefully i dont have to wait that long. But once i get it to be a stable growth, i will then order the microscope and hunt then hunt for the clams as i think i have everything else now that i need.
 
Sorry for the long wait for a post. Still trying to get this ISO G algae to cultivate. Its only been a week and i dont see much of a sign that its growing. So maybe it'll take another week. I'll post again on friday-sunday to let you know of any updates. If i cant get this stuff to grow, i think i might just go ahead with finding some bigger clams and atempt to breed AFTER i make sure that they are healthy in my tank. So that may take a little while...
 
I agree with others-- investing in even a modest microscope is 110% worth it. Actually i think its worth it for most serious hobbyists. if you had a scope, you could count sperm and eggs with a hemocytometer. I do a lot of cell culture for work and I've come to the conclusion that you can guess with ratios of suspended cells but you will have a better outcome if you control things a bit more closely. a microscope and a cell counter will also make your plankton culture a bit less voodoo-like. good results come with optimization.

neat project! good luck!
 
oh one other question-- I'm not sure if many people have looked into the species of zooxanthellae that inhabit clam mantels vs those that inhabit corals, and i dont know exactly when the young clams take up their symbiotes. It was my impression that they took up the zooxanthellae after settling. If this is the case, I would do two things after they settle. First, I would grind up some SPS coral frags, cut the filtration for a SHORT while and add the slurry to your grow out tank. they dont need to be nice ones. the color comes from the corals attempt to control the light that gets to the zooxanthellae, not the zooxanthellae itself. Then after you have turned the filters back on and cleared the tank I would add as many adult clams as you can to the tank. who knows how much zooxanthellae is shed by the adults as part of their normal physiology.
 
Yeah. I'm going to get a microscope. I'm having trouble right now with getting my ISO galbana populating. I think I had some contamination because the bottle is turning green and not brown....
 
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