Breeding Log: Pterapogon Kaudnerni

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123821Bangaii_Male_Holding2.jpg

(picture above is of my male bangaii, holding a clutch of eggs)


Pterapogon Kaudnerni: The Bangaii Cardinal

Origin: Banggai Archipelago in Indonesia.


The Bangaii Cardinal is one of my favorite fish and makes an excellent addition to any reef tank. They're failry shy, docile and extremely reef safe. Luckily for me and many others, they are also very easy to breed. This particular species of marine fish has a very unique method of breeding, very similar to the mouth-brooding cichlids in African rift lakes. A male bangaii will find a compatible mate, this can take from a couple days to a couple weeks for the pair bonding to take place.. They then will proceed with a mating dance, which I've been unable to witness in person. A couple weeks later, the couple will spawn, and the male will take the clutch of eggs into his mouth for approximately 19-20 days when the eggs then hatch. After hatching the male will hold the larval fish for another 6-10 days. Essentialy taking care of a difficult process for us. Once these little guys are released they are free swimming and on their own. These newly released bangaii's are known to host within the long protective spines of certain species of urchin in the wild. So a surrogate urchin or real urchin is recommended to give these little guys a place to hide and feel safe. Recent estimates account for about 50 to 120 thousand individuals a month are being captured for sell in the ornemental fish trade. Since this particular species in endemic to the bangaii islands, I am in full support of captive breeding and raising of these fish. They are extrememly limited in the wild and in 2000 it was proposed to put these fish on the threatened species list. I don't know any newer info on this though. sorry.

Now that you have a bit of backround info on these awesome fish, here where I'm sitting: I have had one successful spawning and release of 12 babies. This happened without any outside influence on my part so I chose to wait for a breeding log until I could get more photo's and information. But, my pair is jumpin' the gun again and have just spawned again last night, 11/09/2006. So heres the breeding log for discussion and I'll give some info about my setup and anything special I'm doing for breeding purposes.

My pair are currently residing in a 55g mixed reef tank, 10g sump w/cheato, 54w x 4 teklight, 100lbs of LR, 3-4inch sandbed. MJ1200, Seaclone Skimmer, Cap1800 return pump. This is a very simple setup, with alot of cheap gear being utilized. The reason I mention this is that people shouldn't be afraid of trying to breed these fish because they may feel there setup won't do. I will eventuall setup a breeding center for my bangaii's, involving a 20gL for the parents to live and spawn, and another 20H for a grow out tank, complete with a long-spined sea urchin.

Back to the fish; Since live foods have shown an increase in spawning with captive fish, over eating prepared meals, flakes, pellets, I have been feeding frozen mysis cubes. This is as close to live foods as i could get for them, and they relish every morsel they can get. Since there last spawning I have made sure that the male gets well fed, he does not eat during the incubation process and will lose much of his body weight, as does the female after spawning. So they have both been fattened up a bit over the last several weeks. I missed their spawning and even their mating dance this time, but i couldn't miss the male holding a large bunch of eggs. This is one of the only times you can sex the species, the male holding eggs (as seen in the photo at the begining of this thread) will take on a bulldogish appearance with the lower jaw protruding out a bit. After his last release, his mouth went back to looking identical to the females and it became very difficult to tell the difference. Now I simply have to wait until they release. The female in the meantime will be eating heavily, and on anything she can get too. Once she fattens up and builds enough of her body mass back, she'll be ready to spawn again. And from what I've seen before, it won't matter if the babies are released or not, she'll still entice the male. And may i add, that was a funny site to see, If any fish ever gave his spouse a dirty look, it was then! So, while I'm waiting here are a few of the photos I've managed to get so far.

123821BabyDeltaForce.jpg

My last batch o' babies! 8 now remain out of the original 12. 3 deaths were due to human error, the 4th I am unsure. In all likely hood, he starved. The babies are being fed newly hatched brine shrimp. Since the aretmia nauplii loose almost all nutritional value after 24-36hours post hatching, I attribute this to the death of the most recent baby. I'm feeding the nauplii a mix of yeast,micro-food, and phytoplankton. Hopefully this will suffice nutrion wise to sustain the babies. Newly hatched shrimp are added every couple days to this shrimp culture and there being fed quickly enough to warrant frequent hatchings. The Bangaii Babies get fed once in the morning prior to work, and several times after i get home in the evenings. Since they are contained in a breeding net for the time being this makes it easy to feed em. I've actually started taking them out of the net and puting them into a specimen container in the evenings, this keeps the nauplii in the container with them and not spreading around the entire 55g.

For some more information on Bangaii's and breeding here is a link to a very thorough manual on the topic:http://www.raingarden.us/banggaimanual.pdf

Just a side note: These are my first marine fish ever succesfully bred, and hopefully will be my first succesful fish raising as well.

Thanks to everyone for their support and I'll be posting more pics and information soon!
 
Updates

Updates

I've got a couple picks I wanted to share.
This first is my pair of bangaii's, can't tell from this photo but the female actually seems protective of the male. He will stay in the back corners of the tank, or hidden under overhangs, and in caves. The female will approach me every time I attempt to view the male up close. And i've seen her chase some of the other livestock away from him as well. isn't that sweet? You can clearly see the jaw structure difference in the male vs. females after spawning has taken place.

123821bangaiipair.jpg


The second is a newer shot of my baby bangaii's. This is about 3 weeks old and since have grown another millimeter or so in length. I have 8 of the original 12 still swimming strong and eating well.

123821babies3weeks.jpg
 
Quick Update:

Quick Update:

I'll try to get a pic up in the next few but thought everyone would like to know, my babies (now at about 6-7 weeks old) are starting to get their spots on their side fins. My little guys are growing up! They have also gotten so used to me staring with my monstrously huge head over their breeder net that when i go to feed em, or even poke a finger at em, they all come running and see what's going on. These guys are going to be so tame once older.

As for the new clutch of eggs, the male is still holding quite a mouthful and should be only a few weeks until he releases the next batch of babies. By then my new grow out tank should be ready. For this I am putting together a 20L, hopefully with an overflow so I can keep a cheato sump going and have made a homemade sea urchin using nothing more than a 1" pvc endcap filled with weed wacker twine. This should suffice until a proper urchin is purchased. I've had beaucoup successs with raising the artemia to adulthood, feeding mainly on phyto and bacteria that grows in the used brine shrimp water (I save the water from changes and reuse it over and over, the bacteria growth will feed aretmia and give em a reddish appearance, whenthey feed mostly on phyto, they get a nice green coloring to em. I see both in my culture so the babies are getting a variety at least.)

Still no luck getting the little tykes to eat anything other than the brine shrimp yet. Although they have been witnessed snatching a piece or two of cylcopeeze from time to time. I add a smidge to their brine feedings in hopes that they'll get used to both foods being introduced to them and may start to eat em both.
 
How old do they have to be before you can get them on flake or pellet foods? How old until they are able to be sold as adultish fish?
 
I plan on raising them to 4 months as a minimum before i try to sell em. I have heard some people selling them as soon as 3 and more of a 5-6 month range as an average. I'll kinda play it by ear mostly though. At this age though they are still considered Juivi's. Bangaii's in the wild are thought to mature at 11-14 months of age but in home aquaria they can be seen pairing off in as little as 4 months and breeding in 6-8 months. I would like to try and sex them first and sell them in pairs. This can be tedious and difficult as adults are hard to determine sex and juvi's are nearly impossible. The one for sure determining factor is when a male is holding a clutch of eggs. And for what it's worth, bangaii's have repeatedly shown a 1m:1f sex ratio. so out of 8 babies left, I could very well have 4 pairs. Hopefully that is the case.


As for flake and pellet foods, my adult bangaii's are just now getting to where they will eat most flakes and pellets, so I don't know for sure. I figure it'll be a trial and error thing as they are growing. The sooner the better i think though.
 
Adam your fish are so pretty. Great job on the raising of the fry. I'm wondering if you have their grow out tank set up like a real reef environment.

I raise Tanganyika cichlids and read somewhere that they need to have current, gravel and rocks to help them developed into "a more rounded, better adjusted fish. Wonder where I read that...

I am trying this total tank decor concept with my latest juvies but I don't really know how it will turn out unless I follow them thru adulthood. I do see that my youngsters are less timid than their parents that were probably raised in a fairly sterile environment with little human contact. Mine are in my computer room.

I have a young pair of clowns that stay up in the corner of their 37 tank. I got them a small anemone but they don't leave their corner. I am wondering if this is because they are tank raised.

They will go into the 75 tank and be with other fish. I am hoping they see that they are suppose to explore the "reef." Another idea I am playing with is to get one of those fake anemones and hang it at the top where they are. I will gradually move it near the real one. Think this will work?

Anyway. You might consider a reef like environment for your juvies.
 
It's not because they are tank raised. I think it is because they have decided that corner is their home. Mine did that at first, and then moved to other "homes". The list includes xenia, colt coral, and hairy mushrooms. Wait until they mature a little. They will love your tank!
 
The Great Bangaii Escape!!!

The Great Bangaii Escape!!!

Came home yesterday to find the netting around the "breeding net" that housed all the baby bangaii's hanging low and open and no babies to be found. So we searched and searched. managed to recover 7 of the 8 escapee's, 1 was found just this morning on the way to work. I'm hoping the 8th is still alive and will make his way to the fuge before I get home. What a scare!
 
Oh jeeze! I'm glad that you found all but one. I hate to be mean, but that's kind of funny. Do you expect your cat as the helper of the escapees?
 
Oh no, cat had nothing to do with it. Once again, this is my fault, I didn't pay attention during boyscouts when we were learning to tie knots. And yeah, I thought it was kinda funny too, they all just made a run for it, so help me god if I find a little screwdriver in the net (like on rugrats)..... The one I found this morning was just chillin' next to a large hairy mushroom. Was so cool looking out in the open swimming around.
 
Update:

Update:

The 6 remaining babies were finally moved to a separate grow out tank. A 2.5gallon nano, thanks to Serra (rc) for the great setup. Setup consist of a simple sponge filter, small heater, small incadecent light bulb, and a few chunks of live rock. Well, one decent chunk of rock and two nice branchy pieces of Stag Coral that have set in the sump of my main tank since it's conception. Within a few minutes all the babies were swimming around exploring their new home (I have pics but will be this weekend at the earliest that i get em posted.) I did find one baby dead last night, I attribute this to the stress of moving to a new home, honestly I can't say for certain the COD but being my first attempt at raising marine fish, this was to be expected. A couple of the infants, one in particular, have gotten large enough eat on adult brine shrimp (gut loaded w/ phyto,micro-food, and yeast). He's gotta work that guy into his gut but he seems more than willing for the larger food. They still have their calm and friendly attitudes towards us, even with all the new hiding spaces, they'll poke their heads out from the rock work and come swimming up to us when they think their getting fed, it's so cute.
As for the Male Bangaii, he is sitting at 23 days holding the clutch as of this morning and the eggs have yet to hatch. Although I did get a good look into his mouth last night and saw a few eyeballs inside the eggs staring back at me, I expect them to hatch anytime now, followed by another week until release. Although I have hear of Male's in captivity releasing as early as 14 days, so It could be anytime that he spits em out after hatching. I plan on sticking my homemade sea urchin in the tank prior to this in hopes that I might save more than 12 babies out of this liter. The more the merrer. As for the main grow out tank, I'm in the process of still planning and seting this up. I am hoping to recreat as natural of a habitat as I can for them along with two black spiney urchins (I read that they can be bred in captivity with ease as well, so might as well give that a whirl while I'm at it :D ).
stay posted for more pics coming soon, one nice one of the large baby eating on an adult brine shrimp, so vicous! :rollface:
 
I saw Adam's babies as well as the adult pair. Man are they pretty! The babies are amazing in that their fins are so formed and they look like minitures of their parents.

I am glad they are enjoying their new home. Get the bigger grow out tank ready. I bet they really start to grow now.

Beautiful fish and a job well done Adam!
 
Update: New Grow Out Tank 12/01/2006

Update: New Grow Out Tank 12/01/2006

Heres some photo's of the nano grow out tank I put together for the newly released Baby Bangaii's. The Juvi's will be going to a larger 20 gallon Long, grow out tank while these newly released guys get the 2.5g.

123821babygrow_out_tank.jpg


123821babygrow_out_tank3.jpg


123821hungry_bangaii_baby.jpg


Yes, that is a full adult artemia in the babies mouth, This one likes going for the large sea monkies while the rest get the little new bbs.
 
Almost forgot:

Almost forgot:

My male bangaii has been holding a clutch of eggs now for well over his 22day estimated time, but day before yesterday we noticed the eggs hatching. Should be anyday now we'll be hearing the pitter patter of little fins again. Up to a week before he releases, but i think he'll do it sooner than that. (one of the impatient babies keeps sticking a tail or fin out of his mouth, he swims around with that thing stuck like a piece of celery in his teeth, it's funny)
 
Hey Adam, just curious. You said that you found 7 of the 8 babies that escaped in your 55 gal. But then you said you moved the 6 remaining babies into the 2.5 gal. Did one of them die? Just wondering...

-Chris
 
Yeah, I'm down to just 5 now. One didn't handle to move to the 2.5 very well either. I think the two 'natural' deaths that occured int he breeding net were caused by the net getting clogged and very little water movement in there. May have suffocated them. The one that died after moving over to the 2.5 may have simply been stressed induced, or he was simply a weak link in that particular chain. The rest was good ol' fashion human error. I hope to get much better survival rates this next time. I already have a DIY urchin in the tank, hopefully this will keep more babies alive until I can catch em all.

123821DIYurchin.jpg


Weedwacker twine and a 1" pvc endcap. I think I made it a bit big, but I havn't seen a full adult urchin before and I figured the male would want to release the babies into the biggest and best urchin he could find. So far most the other fish don't go near the thing. Even my clowfish scooted over a frogspawn or two to keep away. maybe to a fish it looks like an angel of death or something, I think it's pretty and blue!.
 
Paul, you ever see black weed wacker twine? I havn't, and I looked everywhere! I'm sure I could've found something black that would have worked but since this was dirt cheap I went this route. I'm keeping the fingers crossed that my fish are color blind.
 
Update: 12/05/2006

Update: 12/05/2006

I was staring at my Bangaii's last night and noticed the female bangaii is starting to hint that she's all ready for another batch of eggs. This little dance of hers is pretty funny to watch, she "gyrates" at the male, much like I see my clownfish doing. Then she tends to move from side to side of the male, I can only assume it's fish talk for somekind of "nagging". :D Of course daddy still has a mouthful, and what a mouthful it is! Half the time we are looking at him, he's got several fins and tails sticking out of his mouth now. Those babies are getting impatient!
He held the eggs for about 32 days before they hatched. This seems a little high compared to the typical 22-25 days. His last clutch went long too, but the time he held the hatched babies was shorter than the typical week. He also still looks like he's hanging around the DIY urchin more and more. I'll try to get the pic posted this weekend but Jess finally managed to get a shot of one of the babies sticking his face out and looking at us. So eager to start their journey through life.....and most likely the sump/fuge as well. My DIY urchin is strategically located next to the overflow...i think without the fuge, I would have lost all the babies last time. And as a bonus, if they are released while I'm at work, and they make it to the fuge, they'll have a massive population of pods and amphipods to eat on until I get em to their new home.
The 5 babies I have in the grow out tank from the last batch are finally showing more signs that they are willing to search around for food. for the longest time they would all stay together as a group and look content to wait until feeding time. But now, I have to really look around their tank to make sure their all still in there. They are in and out of all the little nooks and crannys. Still very docile and all will come up to the front of the glass once they notice me. Going on 2 months old now.

fwiw, heres a new shot of the Male bangaii. Hard to make out anything in his mouth, but rest assured they are in there.
1238212nd_clutch_of_eggs.jpg
 
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